Full Episode Transcript

Dr. Ashley Blackington (00:00.942)

Hello and welcome back to the AND/BOTH podcast. I am here today with Amanda Hoffman and she is from Go To Market, which she's going to tell you about. But first of all, welcome and thank you for joining me today.

Amanda Hofman (00:14.317)

Thanks so much for having me. I'm excited to talk to you today.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (00:17.518)

Yeah, so first things first, you get to give your spiel in whatever direction you want to take that, mom, business, all of the above.

Amanda Hofman (00:28.621)

Yes, well, of course we are all of those things. So I live in New York City with my husband, my two kids and my dog. And I am now running my second company. It's called Go To Market. We are a branded merchandise studio who are changing everything about, trying to change everything about branded merchandise and about how brands and companies approach branded merchandise and swag. We're really anti -junk.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (00:31.394)

Yes.

Amanda Hofman (00:56.525)

We're trying to help companies create items that people want to keep in the long run. So not a throwaway t -shirt, not a throwaway pen. We want the items that we design to really reflect the values of a company and get to that if you know, you know piece that really attracts people to brands. And the way we do that is through beautiful design. We also do everything in, we create stores for our clients. So they're digital print on demand stores where people can order what they want and the size, shape, color, and style that they want it. So there's a choice element, which of course makes things stick here as well. So if you're a t -shirt person, you can get your t -shirt. If you're a mug person, you can get your mug. And if you don't want any, you can also opt out.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (01:34.414)

I love that. That's an important choice because I feel like a lot of times, especially when it comes to swag, it's like, this is happening. So like pick one and yeah, pick your junk. And now I've done my job as the like swag distributor and there it goes. And that's what leads to like, you know, the drawers of stuff and the, yeah, clutter, clutter.

Amanda Hofman (02:04.397)

Yes, I think companies often don't consider the fact that they're actually giving people a burden when they're giving people something that they don't want or that isn't high quality or that's kind of junky. Like, it's just I really, I feel really strongly about giving people choice in what they want and if they want something.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (02:27.342)

Yeah, yeah, I feel like for a long time, the focus was the transaction of giving versus the actual item. So it was like we as the company gave all of these things to people. So like we did a thing for people, therefore they now have to like want to be around us or whatever. And it's just this idea of like, I don't I don't owe you something because you gave me something kind of thinking.

Amanda Hofman (02:51.117)

Well, gifting is still really powerful and there is a reason for companies to do it. There's a reason that we like getting gifts even when we don't like the gift, right? So there is a power. I mean, there's a reason that we take this junk in the first place, even though we know when we get home, we're like, ugh, why did I take five pens? I can hardly close my pen drawer as it is. But we take it because we love gifts. And I think gifts are actually an important part of humanity, an important part of our connection to things.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (02:58.958)

Mm -hmm.

Amanda Hofman (03:21.325)

Like we want to be a part of a community and we want, you know, to wear things that represent our, that are, reflect our identity, right? It's just, there's a mismatch in what's given and what's received. And then there's like that bummer feeling that comes afterwards. It's kind of like a hangover when you take a gift and then you're like, ugh, what am I doing with this actually? Right? Like I was just at an event and it was a great event and they had this like big gift bag and in it was a box of banana bread mix from Chrissy Teigen,

Dr. Ashley Blackington (03:35.372)

Mm -hmm. Oh, nice.

Amanda Hofman (03:51.085)

which, I'm a big fan of hers and I love cooking and I love baking, but I find bananas revolting, revolting. Like, I just, not only would I not make this mix, but I wouldn't let anyone in my house make it either because the smell would just, it's gross, right? So like, what do I do with this mix now? Well, I don't want to throw it away because it's like high quality and organic and blah, blah, blah. I don't really know who to give it to. So right now it's just lingering. It's just still in a bag hanging on my closet door in this limbo of like, I don't know what to do with this. And that sucks. Sucks for everyone. Everyone loses in that case, right? Like it's a burden for me. The person who gave it to me isn't getting the benefit because I'm not like, ooh, what a great person who gave me this banana bread mix. And we see that all the time with like candles, journals, t -shirts.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (04:27.342)

Yeah.

Amanda Hofman (04:44.139)

Bottles of wine to people who don't drink, cookies to people who are gluten free. It's just impossible to get it fully right all the time, but the intention is good. So you can create these print on demand merchandise shops or gift shops. People choose what they want. And then there's just an efficiency that I find really beautiful.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (04:52.844)

Yeah. And, and too, yeah, I mean, that like the whole thing, right, is they make the choice, they're going to wear the thing they're going to. I feel like it's a great opportunity for people to get into that phase of thinking of being like, no, I don't have to take this just because you handed it to me, but I really like that. And I would rather have that and I will wear that. And then it does the thing that merch is supposed to do, right? Like you, you wear the shirt, you carry the bag, you do all of that. I went to.

Amanda Hofman (05:32.205)

become a brand ambassador.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (05:33.806)

Exactly. I went to an event last summer, I think, and got a bunch of stuff in a bag, came home and said, oh, I'm going to go through this and see the stuff that I want to keep and the stuff that I don't. I'm not kidding. I pulled the bag out last weekend and I went last summer. It's just because it's hanging in a closet in my office that like, you know, we don't keep jackets in or anything. It's all my work stuff.

Amanda Hofman (05:59.949)

Because it gets overwhelming. I have the same thing. I went to this event last Thursday. Granted, that's not last summer. It's been only five days. When you live in Manhattan, like, stuff that's out is out. It's not hidden somewhere. It's like in your face all the time because you don't have a ton of living space. So it's a burden. It's a burden. I think we don't acknowledge that enough. I mean, I'm a big fan of Marie Kondo art of tidying up. I mean, every now and then. I'll shake my fist and be like, why did I get rid of that? Like when a costume party comes up or something. And I'm like, damn, I had a sequin dress and I got rid of it because I literally never wear it. But now there's a costume party and it's like, okay. And now I don't have my sequin dress, but also I'm really glad that I haven't had a sequin dress hanging in my closet that I wasn't gonna wear for five years. But there really is something to not having stuff around that isn't what we want.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (06:32.566)

Yeah. Now I am sequin dressless. Have you always lived in New York?

Amanda Hofman (07:02.157)

Pretty much, I've been here since college. So I've been living in small spaces since I was 18.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (07:04.302)

Yeah, So before that, I mean, before that you're a teenager. So I guess that's whole different period of life anyways, where you just have so much stuff. But like, I wonder if having like in New York, everything is tight and you know, this space is so valuable. So does that, do you feel like that has a huge influence or any influence on the iteration of go -to -market that is there now?

Amanda Hofman (07:14.541)

Yeah, absolutely. I think that in order to live successfully in an apartment, especially with kids, I feel like you have to be ruthless about getting rid of things. Like my friends who are here for the long run, like I'm here for the long run, the second our child grows out of something, it is gone, gone, disappear, don't look back. And it's just like, it's almost like a matter of survival here. Like you can't live.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (07:56.406)

Mm -hmm.

Amanda Hofman (08:02.069)

I mean, unless you just have like loads and loads and loads of money and you just like, I guess have extra bedrooms and storage facilities and you can do that. Even that's like a miserable, it's a miserable way to live, I think. Just like be saving and saving and saving stuff for when it might come up and in the city it really forces you to do that in a way that my friends who live in the suburbs or have houses, it's like, yeah, let's keep that. That might be an art project later on or like, oh, you know what, save that. My kid doesn't want it, but maybe I'll use it as a gift for someone else. And it's like all those possibilities add up into this world of clutter. And.

I think that when you're culling your closet and your clothes and then you take out like 30 branded t -shirts that like, this was from this conference, this was from this event. Or I was at an event and there was a tequila company and they were giving out these kind of ugly tank tops. I thought that they were ugly. I'm sure somebody else really liked them.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (09:00.302)

Hahaha.

Amanda Hofman (09:03.297)

But, you know, if I had taken that, which I think in another iteration of my life I would have, another stage in my life, I would have been like, ah, free t -shirt, right? It's like that stuff is like, it's a clutter that harms you mentally, I mean, it's not gonna harm you physically. And it, I don't know, I appreciate living, this is gonna sound like such a lie, but it's true, I do appreciate living in a smaller space where I have to be more economical about what I'm keeping and not keeping because otherwise I would just keep everything because it's too hard to decide to throw things away.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (09:39.278)

Mm hmm. Yeah. And to the like, the cataloging of everything, like the living in a place where, you know, you have extra closets and you have all of that the storage stuff. It's not like it's not like you're actually calm from that. You know what I mean? Like it's like, like, you know, before you even get to your closet, there is no sequin dress in that closet, versus the person who's like, Oh, but I have a sequin dress, which closet did I leave it in? Where is it? And now it's that constant keeping track of things, which as moms, we know as like a second and third language often, you know, it's like people can't find.

Amanda Hofman (10:17.741)

Yeah, it's very taxing. And especially, I'm an arts and crafts girl and mom. I just love it and love it for myself and for my kids. And like, anything can be an art supply, right? Like, uh, my daughter's shoe, like the sole was coming off of the shoe. And we kind of like, she was like, can I rip it all the way apart? We were gonna throw them out. I'm like, yeah. And then we looked at it and we're like, what can we do with this? And she was like, let's save it. And I'm looking at it and I'm like, oh hell no, we're not saving the part.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (10:46.924)

hahahahah

Amanda Hofman (10:48.973)

But like the arts and crafts part of me is like, well, that could be a puppet later. Or like the shoelaces could be part of like some other art project or like something with strings. And so like there is a little bit of squashing of creativity. But I think that I try to balance that by thinking that you actually can be more creative when your space is not cluttered.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (11:10.926)

Yeah.

Amanda Hofman (11:11.885)

And I see this looking at, I'm looking at you and behind you as a stack of papers that is hideous. So like, I do not always follow through on that, but I strive to do that.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (11:23.086)

Yeah, no, I hear that 100 percent. Like I right now it's like this crazy kind of in my own office right now. It's like it feels like the walls are falling in, but they're not. It's just I have camp paperwork for the kids and like sports things. And oh, my God, I just picked up a stack of physicals and copies of immunizations and all of this for the kids to go to camp this summer. And I'm just like.

Amanda Hofman (11:38.795)

I'm going have to for work.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (11:50.252)

Oh my God, why? But then also you have to fill in the form and then upload the form. There's so much, I don't know, there's so much doubling of effort that just doesn't need to happen. And...

Amanda Hofman (12:04.077)

just balancing. So I have the exact same stack over here. I got my jury summons. I've got the doctor's forms that are wrong that I need to send back. And it's like all these things that we're balancing and like all the, you know, the merch from the last conference that I went to and a few business cards and a few fidgets and you know, I, I,

Dr. Ashley Blackington (12:08.174)

Mm -hmm.

Amanda Hofman (12:25.101)

When I'm at my best, when I am working at my best, I have a clean desk, which seems really obvious. We've all heard that before, but I think that's true. I mean, it guides me in branded merchandise, but it guides me in life also. It's like, if you could, I just read this book called Work Clean, and it's about taking a chef's approach to working and it's like don't have tabs open that you're not using. It's like when you're done with something close all the tabs and I've actually been doing that. Some people are like spitting on the ground that I'm even saying this. But it really is it's just everything's fighting for our attention and if you've got clutter out whether it's like digital clutter, physical clutter.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (12:49.806)

Yeah.

Amanda Hofman (13:11.277)

Or like when you're getting dressed in the morning, you have to weave through 15 t -shirts that you don't like to get to the one that you do like. It's like these tiny little taxes that we pay every time we look somewhere. And it's like, I find that I'm clearer and a better parent and a better worker in all the things when I keep a cleaner space.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (13:38.094)

Yeah, I think like I echo that, you know, from the rooftops with a bullhorn because I noticed that, I noticed that for me in my office for sure, but I also notice it in the like the play space that our kids have. So if the playroom that they have looks like a bomb went off, nobody goes in there. No, and then what happens, you can't know and they.

Amanda Hofman (13:59.053)

They won't play. Yeah. You cannot play anymore.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (14:03.79)

then what happens is the playroom starts to migrate out around the house and then all of a sudden everything and it's like, we have to like make some sort of funnel system, i .e. all of the children picking up their stuff and putting it back in the playroom and then like every once in a while it sort of gets way far away from you and I go in, pull out all the broken stuff, the dried markers, all of those things, and then everything just gets put back, and they help to, and everything gets put back, and then all of a sudden it's like, where are my kids? Oh, they're all in the playroom, and they've all got their little pocket of space, and I'm like, see guys, if you just clean the playroom, and they're like, yeah, too busy.

Amanda Hofman (14:30.157)

Thank you. Ta -da! Look, it's something we need to learn again and again through life. And again, it goes back to that concept of like, we like getting gifts. We like playing with what we're playing with. It's like, our instinct is to say yes to more things, right? Like, I want to do this and I want to do that. I want to color, I want to work on this coloring project and I want to do this Perler bead project, right? And it's like, sometimes we just need to get rid of the one that's not working for us at the moment, even though it has potential. Even though that broken sneaker has potential for an art project, it's not free to keep it, is I guess what I'm trying to say. It's not free to take branded merchandise from a company that is gonna gunk up your drawer and make it harder to find the things that you actually need and want.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (15:22.382)

Yeah, there's a cost. Mm -hmm. Yeah, I agree. So my favorite example of this in getting rid of stuff that you don't use or you don't like, not necessarily favorite example, but the most hilarious example that I have saw over and over again is, so my background's in occupational therapy and I worked in the hospital. So people that would come in for like an injury, a surgery, something happened, whatever. So it's 99 % of them are unplanned admissions to the hospital. So people go into the hospital, everything happens, and then they move on to rehab. And that's where I spent the majority of my clinical time. So these people didn't know they were going to the hospital. They could not pack to go to the hospital. And so what would happen is their family member would go into their dresser and pull out a bunch of clothes and throw them in the bag and be like, here, I brought you clothes from home. The vast majority of people were like, I haven't seen that t -shirt in so long. I haven't worn that. And like, what what kind of underwear is this? Like where how did you even find this stuff? And it's like. Yeah, yeah, it's like, no, but that's your stuff. You just haven't gotten rid of it because you're used to doing what you're talking about is like wading through the things you don't want to find the thing that you want. And like from that example, I was always like, OK, have got to make sure that like.

Amanda Hofman (16:44.429)

who you are. I don't know who this is.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (17:02.648)

These things are cleared out because I don't want someone to show up if I ever go into the hospital with this bag of like looks like it didn't even come from my dresser because it's like those are those pajama pants haven't fit me in 10 years. Why do I have them? Yeah, get rid of it.

Amanda Hofman (17:17.837)

Yeah. Yeah. And it's not just, it applies to so, I feel like we've covered this, but like, it really applies to like parenting, playing, working, just thinking clearly. It's across the board and it takes discipline and it's hard. I think that's the other thing that doesn't come up. It's like, oh, well just clean up. It's easy. It's like, no, there are decisions that we need to make. It's not like doing the dishes. It's a decision. You're closing the door to a potential future with the sequined dress. I'm closing the door to say, I'm not the kind of person who's gonna wear this sequined dress. And trusting that if I am the kind of person down the road, and I'm like, you know what, I am a sequined dress person that I can go out and get another sequined dress.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (17:55.63)

Mm -hmm. I feel like that is a big benefit of living in Manhattan is that there are probably a thousand places that you could go and find a sequined dress.

Amanda Hofman (18:14.221)

That is true, I could go anywhere for a sequin dress. I can also just like roll downstairs and get like pizza from five different places. So yes, that might be a New York specific, I can get a sequin dress. But with Amazon, you really can get a sequin dress anytime. It's open to anyone.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (18:22.252)

That's true. That is true. Yeah, I am. Oh, what was I? We were just talking about. I lost my thought. It flew right out of my head. It'll come back. So how old are your kids? While I think of my thoughts.

Amanda Hofman (18:46.541)

They just turned 10 and 12. It's hard to say it. You know, when they just change age and you're like, wait, my kids are nine and 11. They're not 10 and 12, but they are 10 and 12. It feels much harder.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (18:55.15)

Yeah. And do they are they so they're in school then? Because I've started when I when I started this podcast, I used to sort of I used to ask people about like their kids and things like that. And we never talked about the caregiving part of it. And we never talked about the childcare part. And I realized that especially when I talked to not especially anybody, but any any parent like the how do you how do you make it all work together is a really important question because I think that's the thing that we don't talk about in this day and age. Like how does it all happen because the time and the effort and all of that comes from somewhere.

Amanda Hofman (19:31.469)

How does it all happen?

Dr. Ashley Blackington (19:50.414)

And I feel like this generation of parents is the like, this is the thing that we don't talk about. Like people talk about like salaries and income now but they don't talk about childcare or like how all of that happens. And so.

Amanda Hofman (19:52.845)

Yeah, it's not like here are my nannies hours and here's my other nanny and then here's the week my nanny.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (19:58.222)

Yeah, yeah, exactly. And it's interesting because like a lot of times I feel like even in my own bias, it would be like, well, that person really has so many things figured out. And then when I started to ask the questions, it was especially if people that had younger kids and they were doing, they were starting businesses and things like that, like how, how? And they're like, oh, I have like live in childcare.

Amanda Hofman (20:24.395)

Exactly, they've gotten no pair or yeah, one thing that was apparent to me, so I have two kids, which I said, and for a little bit, we were thinking about having a third child. And when I looked around, my friends who had third children and were thriving, all had their mother or somebody in their family really close to them who was basically like a third parent in addition to whatever childcare they had. So it was like basically three parents plus whatever regular childcare another person would have. And that gave me some peace of mind because I'm like, oh, I'm not crazy, right? Because I was looking at it, I'm like, there's no way I can manage having a third kid here. I mean, of course, if I had to, I would, right? And you figure it out. You just figure it out. But I couldn't picture it in terms of like feeling sane and feeling like I could give enough to the children and myself and my marriage. And, you know, I wasn't working at the time. But and that's not to say everybody has that. But in my world, in my very narrow Manhattan world where I am, there is a lot of child care pieces that are present and.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (21:42.016)

Yeah.

Amanda Hofman (21:48.444)

Yeah, I applaud you for talking about it because it isn't like we're doing it all. It's like we're doing it with a village. Like we're doing it with help and that's not better or worse. It just is.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (22:00.526)

Yeah, I think it helps give people context too because there are no apples to apples anymore because of family, because of childcare, because whatever it is, whatever your arrangement is. And I think that, yeah.

Amanda Hofman (22:14.541)

And everyone's marriage is different or their partnerships are different, what they take on, what they don't. And you're absolutely right. You can't compare. You really can't.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (22:24.622)

Yeah, and I think we all like, we all, I mean, global statement, but I feel like it's really easy to take face value of someone else's representation and feel like that's the whole story. But like media is

Amanda Hofman (22:39.915)

Mm -hmm. Well, Instagram makes that much worse. I gotta tell you, there was this very famous, huge blogger who went to my kids go to a public school here in New York City, and this very famous blogger's kids went to the same school and we all live, you know, when you're when you go to public school in the city, like you're all live, everyone in the school lives within a very, very small radius. So like we all live within a few blocks of each other because there are so many people that like the zones change really quickly. So you're living within a five block radius. And we would look at this blog at this influencers like blog posts and Instagram posts like living our lives basically like their their kids are eating at the same restaurants, their kids are going to the same school. We're all like buying our food from the same place. Like we're living the same lives, but like, why does hers look so much better? Why does it look so much better? Like, why do I feel jealous? Why do we all feel like less looking at this when like literally we have the same lives?

Dr. Ashley Blackington (23:47.214)

Yeah.

Amanda Hofman (23:52.013)

It's like, it's all a very, it's distorted. It's this like dystopian sort of thing. And so I have been looking at Instagram less and less and less and less. And I mean, again, this is like not a hot take. This is no nothing new here. But I really think that for any mom out there who's feeling less that just don't look at Instagram.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (24:17.644)

Mm -hmm.

Amanda Hofman (24:18.349)

Like you will instantly feel better because it's just not, exactly what you said. It's not the full story. It's a very, it's a narrow view. I am the one millionth person to say this. This is again, not a new idea, but like I can share that in my lived experience, it was very interesting to see this like perfectly polished mom who I knew to be living the same life that I was living. And to see it like kind of, it kind of was apples to apples. Of course it wasn't, we're not in the same marriage. We don't have the same amount of money, like all these things, right? But it was pretty,

Dr. Ashley Blackington (24:36.94)

Yeah.

Amanda Hofman (24:46.893)

pretty close. It's as close as you can get to like a big famous influencer and to be like, oh, like our kids are in the same school. They have the same, like they're just, it's all the same. And yet it, it, it's made to look extremely different. It's aspiration.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (25:03.182)

Yeah. Yeah, the aspiration versus inspiration is just so huge. But I also think too, like, it's not, I think that it's important to have the million people say this is not reality. Because especially, I feel like especially, I was in New York over the summer for a conference and I remember being like, I don't know if I could live here because of that, because it's just like, it's so fast and it's so, I feel like everything is aspirational. Like when there's people like walking down the street at eight o 'clock in the morning in shoes that I couldn't even make it out of my bedroom in, I'm like, this is not like.

Amanda Hofman (25:32.481)

Yeah. You're just in the wrong part of the city then. That's it. I think that for people who like, if you come into Manhattan for a day and you're not used to it, you're gonna leave like with your head up backwards being like, people who live here are insane and you can't do that. But when you live here, you find pockets of peace. You find your, it's very different from a visit, right?

Dr. Ashley Blackington (26:03.182)

Yeah.

Amanda Hofman (26:14.615)

And like, um, when we walk to school in the morning, we pick up the whole neighborhood basically. We see everyone we know on the way to school. It's a short walk. It's like Sesame Street. The business owners are like, hi. It's like everyone knows each other, even though there's a million people here, more than a million obviously.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (26:25.27)

Yeah.

Amanda Hofman (26:37.549)

And yeah, like even I feel that way if I go to Midtown at eight in the morning, like you have to go, or if I go to the meat packing district, I'm like, ugh, I don't fit in here. You know, it's like, you gotta find your pockets.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (26:45.854)

Yeah! Right? Yeah, I mean, I think too, yeah, that's probably perspective because I was in a place that was not a family like area of the city. So I'm not I'm not going to find I'm not going to find fellow parents. Well, I mean.

Amanda Hofman (27:02.893)

Yeah, if you came to school, pick up with me, and we go to the playground, you'd be like, yeah, this is my jam. I can feel that. It's probably a lot more crowded than like, you know, your average playground. But yeah, I think that's where it would be different.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (27:20.43)

Yeah, I think that, yeah, definitely. It would be fun to see, because I feel like there's so many similarities, no matter where you live in the experience of, you know, you've got, you're trying to manage the stuff in your house, you're trying to manage the work that you do, you're trying to manage the caregiving, you're trying to manage all of those things, and it's just a matter of like, where the focus has to be at that particular time is gonna change. However, like we all kind of have the same list. It just might be you're getting in the car and driving to the grocery store versus being able to like walk past a shop on the way home and grab whatever it is you need.

Amanda Hofman (27:50.509)

Right, right. The parameters are different, but the essential elements are the same.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (28:00.43)

Yeah. Yeah. And so what was the business that you did before GoToMarket?

Amanda Hofman (28:09.805)

So I had an events company for women in New York City called Urban Girl Squad. And it was in -person networking for women in their 20s and 30s. And the idea was for women to be able to meet each other and network while doing an engaging fun activity. So we would volunteer together or do a fitness class or do like a makeup class or like a bartending class or like a pole dancing class. It was all kinds of really cool fun activities in New York City where women could meet each other.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (28:34.124)

Yeah.

Amanda Hofman (28:39.759)

their own network. It was super fun. It was a great business for me to run at that time in my life.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (28:41.326)

Oh, that's awesome. I was gonna say, is that a pre -kids business?

Amanda Hofman (28:54.445)

Yes, and I ran it through, I had my daughter and I was just sort of maintaining it until I was pregnant with my son, you know, 18 months later. And that was when I was like, this is not the right business for me anymore. So I was able to sell it, which I'm very grateful that I was able to do. And then I was home with my kids for a long while until my son started kindergarten, my younger one started kindergarten. And at that point I was like, I really want to start another business. And I was looking around and trying to find something that would be inspirational for me and something that would respect.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (29:14.638)

Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Amanda Hofman (29:42.159)

my work -life balance because for my first business it was all work no life which was my intention and my choice it was like very much what I wanted at that point in my life and it worked for me and now I'm like wait my kids are my passion project so what does that mean like can I have a business that I'm really passionate about and also be passionate about my kids and also be present for my kids and it took me years to figure that out.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (29:44.684)

Mm -hmm.

Amanda Hofman (30:10.623)

And what came out of it is the business that I'm running now, GoToMarket. And I'm really proud of what we, my business partner and I have been able to do with regard to our values and our work -life balance and being able to be present for our kids and still run a business that we really enjoy without it, without one taking the other over.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (30:32.654)

Yeah, without having to be the face of the business 24 -7.

Amanda Hofman (30:37.357)

Yeah, I mean I am the face of the business, but the way that we've structured things does not require my attention 24 -7.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (30:48.622)

Yeah, yeah, the attention of the business. That's a better way to say it. And you just won a couple of awards. I saw these, I saw this on LinkedIn. You were featured, not awards, but you were featured.

Amanda Hofman (31:00.877)

I've been featured, I've been in Business Insider, I've been in NASDAQ. We've got a lot of activity going on lately, which is exciting. Yeah. Yeah.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (31:09.836)

Mm -hmm. It was Nasdaq. I think I saw that on maybe on LinkedIn. And how so are you guys is the is the goal. I guess what is the goal? Like what is what is sort of the long the long term plan when it comes to go to market? Like where does that go?

Amanda Hofman (31:32.045)

So I think of it in two different ways. My goal for the business is to really change the way that companies are doing branded merchandise. I really am passionate about that. I think that companies, the way that they're doing it now is just like this inefficiency really makes me sad. And I think it makes a lot of people sad and it's really bad for the environment. And it's just, there's an opportunity to do so much better. And I would like for us to be at the, helm of helping companies do this better. So that's where we are with the business. For me personally, I would like the business to continually, you know, as my kids get older they need me in a time sense, they need me less and less. And so to have a business that can grow, and my business partners' kids are around the same age, so we're kind of in the same boat, but to have a business that kind of grows with my expanding time opportunities, which I think this will, and to sort of meet those needs and like give me something that's challenging, interesting, money -making, and exciting and stimulating all the ways that we want work to be. And then to keep that going. Do I need us to be a Fortune 500 company? Almost definitely not. The goal of this business is really to look at the bigger picture of my life and say, does this business meet the needs of the work part of my life pie?

Dr. Ashley Blackington (33:15.054)

Mm -hmm.

Amanda Hofman (33:15.885)

And as long as it's doing that, I want to keep running it.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (33:19.502)

I love that. I love the idea that it's still you're looking at this as a how does this best fit me? Because I think a lot of times in the culture of the like the side hustle and the mompreneur and all of that, this idea is like you have not achieved success until you are a fortune 500, until you are like ringing the bell on the stock exchange until you know all of those. The goals for success are so far versus and opposite. Yeah.

Amanda Hofman (33:52.301)

Well, the goalpost keeps moving, right? And you need to be bigger and bigger and bigger and bigger. And it's interesting because I see two things happening. On one hand, I'm hearing a lot of anti -hustle, anti -capitalist thinking through exactly what I said, your life goals and how work fits into your life as opposed to the other way around. I think that's like culturally a bit where things are headed. And at the same time, you've got on Instagram and LinkedIn being like, a lot of influencers being like, here's how I made $100 ,000 in two weeks. And here's how I gained 50 ,000 followers in a day. And here's how I would start an account and build it to like X thousand and X amount of time. And so there's these two things going on where there's this fallacy of like easy, quick growth. If only you would follow these things.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (34:29.198)

One hour.

Amanda Hofman (34:43.053)

And then on the other hand, we're hearing, remember the big picture of your life. So again, I've kind of taken the approach of, I really am trying to not be on Instagram and not follow those people because they just make me feel bad. Like truly, the only thing I get from them is like, well, my Instagram following has been hovering around like 1500 for years, even though I'm posting all the time, I'm doing all the things. And that sucks. But at the same time, like my business is growing and things are going well. So it's like, am I failing? I don't know. According to like that real I am, but like according to if I actually check in with like my life, like, no, of course not. So I don't know. It's, I think it's hard to keep perspective in the world of these influencers.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (35:19.95)

Right, like what measure? And I think too, it's really important. It's like the same thing is happening with the like trad wife approach that is, I feel like that's the next generation of Instagram. Like you have these big influencers and things like that. But especially when it comes to like motherhood is that you now have these people who are like, I made intentional choices and everything is slow and we do this, blah, blah, blah. And like, you should want to be like me. But at the same time, like they've got.

Some of them have millions and millions of followers and you cannot do, like being a parent, watching another parent tell you that you need to like slow down and make intentional choices while they have the same amount of children you have or more and you understand what that looks like. But then again, that's where we come into the discussion about childcare. It's like, I feel those people can make you feel bad for not.

Amanda Hofman (36:07.839)

Is it?

Dr. Ashley Blackington (36:34.03)

You're like you're screwed either way, right? Like in one way, you're not working hard enough because you haven't achieved like a social media following that's that size. You haven't achieved a monetary number that's whatever, but you're also failing because in trying to achieve that, you've forgotten that you're like, you need to be ever present and you need to be slow and like, you're damned if you do, damned if you don't.

Amanda Hofman (36:36.501)

Really, if you stop looking at Instagram, you'll forget all that nonsense. And I didn't mean to come on here so anti -Instagram, but I mean, I'm telling you, this instance of this big influencer who went to the school was like, I just had this notion of like, oh yeah, if I had a stylist and a professional photographer following me everywhere, yeah, I'd look like that also. But to what end? That's not what I want, right? Of course, do I wanna look pretty?

Dr. Ashley Blackington (37:01.678)

Yes. Right?

Amanda Hofman (37:27.341)

Yeah, obviously, but like, I don't know, I just think that like, we get pulled away from our values and our like, internal knowledge when we start looking at these like, really sexy things of like, I did this and this in this number of days but also what I find in Instagram, but also just like in the coaching world. And I think that there are a lot of fantastic coaches out there. I have a business coach who I adore, but there are a lot of people who are like in parenting and in business. I did this thing and it worked. So now I'm going to be a coach teaching you how to do that thing. And it's like, no, no, no, that's not how parenting works. Like you have a sample size of one or two.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (38:14.446)

Mm -hmm.

Amanda Hofman (38:14.893)

Like you are not like if you're a pediatrician, that's a different story. You've seen like thousands of children, but like what worked in your home is like very one size fits one. And I think it's the same. You can just apply that across the board. Like just don't listen to people who did a thing that worked for them. And like, they might be extremely successful, but it worked for them. Like there's this one influencer who I actually really like. His name is Brock Johnson. I'm sure you've seen, I was watching him more years ago, but he just is really excellent at teaching people how to do reels. Back when I was doing more reels. And he was like, it's easy, just do this, this and that. And I was like, whoa, dude, like you are successful because you're so good at that.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (38:51.758)

Mm -hmm.

Amanda Hofman (39:04.271)

Like, he's a great dancer. He has great screen presence. He also dedicates his whole life to making reels, right? Like, again, apples to apples. Like, we're not comparing ourselves. Like, if I were to do everything that he did, it wouldn't look like that. Because, like, I'm not him. 

Dr. Ashley Blackington (39:23.022)

Right. Yeah, very impossible. I went to we went to San Diego for spring break with the kids or winter break, whatever it was. And I've never I mean, I live in New Hampshire, so I don't like we don't have a whole lot of like beach time. I mean, not not in the like California beach.

Amanda Hofman (39:27.551)

impossible standards. Uh -huh. Uh -huh.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (39:48.334)

Kind of, it's a little different. Anyway, so I, you know, we went and we took the kids out to the beach and I watched this phenomenon of like people like doing the pictures in the sand, like they're laying there and their friends like taking their picture, but it wasn't just like one person. It was like different groups of people that had the same like Instagram posts, social media, whatever that they're like all doing, all lined up. And I was like, to like be on the backside of it is the most hilarious thing. Cause you're just like.

Amanda Hofman (40:20.205)

hilarious and also like you could cry, right?

Dr. Ashley Blackington (40:22.156)

Yes! Yes!

Amanda Hofman (40:29.367)

Like just so sad. So sad. Yeah. I mean, look, we've all had these experiences and you know, we, I take my kids to Yankees games and you know, we really love it. But every now and again, there's somebody sitting in front of us who's just like videoing the whole game, texting videos of the game to other people, posting to their Instagram stories, posting to Snap, you know, doing Snapchat. And like, they don't give a shit about the game. Like they don't care what's happening. It's really just like, look, I'm here. Look, I'm here.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (40:32.686)

Mm -hmm.

Amanda Hofman (40:54.573)

Look, here I am. I'm at the game. And it's like, tag, tag, tag. And it's like, live your life, man.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (41:02.286)

Right, be present in your life. And that's what I love about getting a chance to meet other people and talk to other people. Because it's like the vast majority is like, I do the thing that I do so that I don't end up getting like sucked down the whole of trying to be have the perfect this and everything looks great and it's polished and stuff like that. Like sometimes it is and sometimes it's not.

Amanda Hofman (41:25.889)

Yeah.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (41:31.918)

Do you notice there are there common themes or common, I guess companies or whatever that reach out that are looking for swag that is not just another pen or just another. Like, is there kind of a demographic?

Amanda Hofman (41:43.949)

Well, I love working with founders and small businesses because they tend to really care. They're passionate about their brand. And when a company is passionate about their brand, that's when they're in the best position to have awesome branded merchandise. Because they have a message that they're trying to communicate, and they have a value that they're trying to get across, and they're trying to stand out in the field, and they also love the brand. So like they're excited to represent it and they want to do it in a way that's beyond the logo. So, but like industry wise, like we work with bookkeepers and accountants. We work with food companies, we work with podcasters, authors.

Amanda Hofman (42:26.317)

I mean, like legal operations, coaches, like there's so many different industries, but I would say the common thread is somebody who really cares about the brand. Or, and or sustainability. Let me add that in there. Somebody who's just like fed up with junk and is like, I don't want to do more plastic nonsense.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (42:33.422)

I love that. I love that it's also, yeah. Yeah, I feel like, because that's how I actually found you in the general scheme of things is that you had posted something on somewhere. I don't know how we initially connected, but you had posted something and it was about not just having stuff for the sake of having stuff.

Amanda Hofman (42:59.565)

in the world.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (43:20.014)

And I was at that point trying to figure out merch for my own stuff and figuring out like where to go from what's going to work and what's not and you and you just had this whole like it was a paragraph or a post or video or something I don't remember what it was but I remember being like that that's the thing like as a

Amanda Hofman (43:36.493)

I'm so glad. I'm so glad it resonated. That makes me so happy.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (43:40.494)

Well, and I think that too, like on your end, like you're your own ideal customer, right? Like you are very passionate about this and that's what makes it fun is that like when two people can connect and have that same goal.

Amanda Hofman (43:53.549)

Yeah, and look, that's personally why I'm running this business. It's like, look, I love branded merchandise. I really do. I always have. I never leave a gift shop without getting something. I'm like the biggest customer of it myself, truly. But really what I'm here for is the conversations about the brand and the business. I love talking to business owners and I love talking to brand managers about what's cool about their brand and how we can represent that in design and in interesting branded merchandise.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (44:03.854)

Mm -hmm. And you're in a good spot to be able to like go and see all of these things because you have all of these incredible conferences where you go. You posted something, it was a couple of weeks ago about like walking around and trying to find the good swag. And I will say I did follow along. It's like, this is hilarious. Mm -hmm.

Amanda Hofman (44:36.181)

Yeah. It was pretty fun. I mean, a trade show is like a circus of really wild things and like people doing really aggressive things to get your attention and merch plays a big part of that in a good way and a bad way. So I like to catalog it. So if any of your listeners want to follow on, you can follow along. You should join in on LinkedIn. That's where I post most of it.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (44:52.366)

Yeah, it's awesome. I had a woman at the trade show that I was at in New York over the summer. Her company, her brand was Period Underwear. And she spent the entire five days in just her underwear. Yeah, yeah. And it was like, you know, one of those like you're setting up your booth or whatever and I look and there's a lady coming down the aisle in her underwear.

Amanda Hofman (45:17.389)

Uh huh. Wow, commitment.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (45:36.066)

And again, I had that like, I am in New York because everyone else is just like doing their thing or whatever, like no one even looks.

Amanda Hofman (45:39.469)

Yep. Yep. Yeah. There's a lot of that going on where we're just like, yeah, there's a dude in a tutu. What else? What else is going on?

Dr. Ashley Blackington (45:44.334)

I mean, it's like, I like your tutu, you know? It's not like, oh, that's weird. It's like...

Amanda Hofman (45:52.653)

Yeah, actually, this was funny. I was at the school, our public school had an auction. It was like 70s themed. This is where I was looking for the sequins. So I ended up getting from Amazon these like bright pink, shiny bell bottom pants.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (46:06.99)

Awesome.

Amanda Hofman (46:17.581)

And as I was leaving the event, I was just like going through the bars because I have to walk through them to get home and I was no longer with, I was with my husband, but I wasn't with other people who were dressed that way. I'm telling you, five different people were like, I love your pants. I'm like, these are insane. I would never wear these if I were not going to a costume party, but I'm fitting in these Saturday night party people. But yeah, they were appreciated.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (46:22.254)

Mm -hmm. I love it. So outside of merch and outside of work, what do you do? What are the things that you do for you?

Amanda Hofman (46:47.853)

I am very much a fitness junkie and I love, I love, love, love the things that I do in that arena. I have been trying to get back into running racing. So I'm like working with a coach to get back to racing. Again, I was not, when I say racing, I don't mean like I was actually competitive. I mean, I just doing the race, yes. And like, you know, getting the times for myself, comparing my current times to my old times, that sort of thing.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (47:12.078)

You're doing it.

Amanda Hofman (47:23.533)

And I do a lot of cycling. I go on like a big bike trip with my husband every summer. You know, we check out like last year we biked through Yellowstone and the year before we biked around the Finger Lakes. And we're planning our trip now for this summer. But I really like adore anything that gets my heart rate up. Except for scary movies. I do hate scary movies.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (47:40.078)

I've loved that. And what do you... Do you, do the kids come with you on these trips?

Amanda Hofman (47:49.613)

The bike trips, no, but they do come to our races. So like my husband does a half Ironman every year and we go to Chiriman back when I was doing running racing, they would come to that. And so they're like into the racing world. Like they, you know, they've got like their signs and the high fives and like they're, they're in that. And my son, when he was eight, he did a kids duathlon, which he really enjoyed. And you know, it's like, we like that world. That's our jam.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (48:18.958)

I love it. That's awesome. Plus it's also like, it's another example of being the example, right? It's not like, okay, kids, go out and run around. It's like, you go out and run around and it becomes the culture.

Amanda Hofman (48:34.861)

Yeah, well, it's interesting because it's not even, we're not putting it on. It's not like, we should do this to be an example for the kids. We're like, we're gonna race and I'm sorry you have to wake up really early in the morning for this, but like this is our life. This is the thing that we're passionate about. So yeah, I mean, obviously the more authentic you can be in your parenting, the better, but that's not a reach for us. For other things, yes, of course. We are faking it until we make it.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (48:45.582)

I think that that is really oftentimes a really undervalued strategy. And sometimes you have to do it for yourself too. It's like I will be awake, but I am not awake. I am awake. I'm gonna be awake. I am participating. Oh my God, when can I go back to bed?

Amanda Hofman (49:15.009)

Yeah. I'm so tired, just so tired all the time, but one day we'll sleep.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (49:26.222)

I hear you. So one day, yeah, many decades from now, and then we'll have to get up to go to the bathroom. So for people that are business owners, because there are a fair number of listeners that have their own business, how can they connect with you and follow you? Maybe not Instagram is the place, but how?

Amanda Hofman (49:31.401)

I want to vlog while I'm out. Uh huh.

Amanda Hofman (49:49.933)

No, you can follow our Instagram. We do post on Instagram and I promise not to post anything that will make you feel bad about yourself. That is something I can guarantee you. You will not feel bad about anything. It will just be like inspiring, cool ideas.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (49:57.23)

Love it.

Amanda Hofman (50:10.253)

So definitely follow us on LinkedIn or it's me on LinkedIn. I'm, you can find me, Amanda Hoffman, just note there's one F in Hoffman. And our Instagram is go to market studio. Our website is go to market dot studio. You can find links for everything everywhere. If you search our name or my name and you if you want to talk about merch for your business, reach out. I will respond to you.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (50:12.46)

I love it. And I will put all the links in the show notes. So if people are driving and don't want to write stuff down or forget like me, because you have the memory of a goldfish, because you have so many things that are again, cluttering your physical and cognitive space. That's like, I love it. All right. Well, thank you so much for joining me. And I just, I love what you're doing. I think it's really cool.

Amanda Hofman (50:32.525)

Fantastic. Take a breath, take a breath, take a breath, clear off your desk. That's my goal today.