Full Episode Transcript

Dr. Ashley Blackington (00:01.01)

All right. Hello and welcome back to the in both podcasts. I am here today with Becca Carnahan and she is from Next Chapter Careers. She's going to tell us all about that. But, um, first of all, I wanted to say hello. Good morning and, um, thank you for coming. Yeah. So, I would love for you to tell everybody a little bit about you and a little bit about what you do, because I am totally fascinated by your business so I have questions but you first.

Becca Carnahan (00:15.863)

Good morning. Thanks so much for having me, Ashley. I would love to, I'd love to. So like you said, my name is Becca Carnahan. I am a career coach and a mom, and I help parents land fulfilling jobs they love without giving up the flexibility that they need. So much of my work is really centered at this intersection of curiosity, creativity, and compassion to help parents connect the dots of their career and help them find work that works for them and then confidently tell that story. So as as mom myself, this is very near and dear to my heart. My background is in career development. I spent 16 years at Harvard Business School doing career development, executive education, and now I love that this is such a big part of my life, that I'm able to bring all of those expert tools and strategies and frameworks to the parents in the playground that would always come to me and say like, hey, I don't like my job anymore. But I don't know what to do about it. Being able to serve those people, my people that I see all the time is such a wonderful part of life.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (01:42.83)

So how, when did you start this business? And how old were your kids is really the math I want to do on this.

Becca Carnahan (01:47.244)

The math, yes. So it goes back really to shortly after my kids were born. So my kids are 15 months apart. So I was doing rapid fire new motherhood. And when they were both very little, I remember thinking to myself, I'm not sure if a traditional nine to five is what I want necessarily, but I don't know what else that looks like. I also don't, I've kind of lost a sense of myself to a certain degree too because you add motherhood onto career equals confusing. There's just so much that's happening at once. So it really started by blogging actually. So when my kids were probably two and three is when I started doing more blogging, writing about working parenthood, started to infuse some more of my career development expertise into this conversation. It was really just funny stories at first, but then started to bring in more of the career development piece. And that's when it kind of naturally evolved into a business, a business on the side. So I was having my, doing my writing, doing some coaching on the side, in addition to working full-time at Harvard Business School. And it was really all coming together. And my goal was when my son went to kindergarten, that I would be able to work full-time for myself. And that's exactly what happened. So when my kids were five and four, that's when I took the jump and said, you know what, I'm going out on my own. I'm fully taking Next Chapter careers out. So that was 2020, which was a roller coaster of a year, to say the least. But that was the year, that was the plan for a long time. And I did it. I left in 2020, September 2020.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (03:32.718)

Right, right.

Becca Carnahan (03:40.427)

And that's, so now we're getting on almost four years, which is wild to think about. This has been my full-time gig for a while now.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (03:49.398)

Yeah, that's awesome. I think it's so fun that there are so many people that like, there's like the personal side of what happened during COVID, but there's also this idea of like, everything really just doesn't fit. And I've been sort of like trying to make everything fit for a really long time and like the overwhelm of everything that happened in that period where people were like, no, like I've hit, I hit the wall, I hit the...

whatever, and like for you to have that as a, as a jumping off point of being like, okay, well, if I'm going to do this, like, let's do this and giving yourself a deadline to, to like make the leap or make the decision. Um, I think it's, I think that's awesome because there's, you know, there was so much unknown then. So that's even an even bigger jump.

Becca Carnahan (04:34.187)

It was so scary. And at the time I was like, well, is this really the right call to do something that's on my own during this really unstable time? You don't really know what's happening. But looking back, it couldn't have been a better time really because so many other, like you mentioned, so many other parents were coming to this realization of like, I've been trying to make this life work, but it doesn't work and I haven't had a time to pause and consider what other possibilities could be out there. So the conversation just really shifted in 2020 of like, what should I be doing to what could I be doing? And that's where I was able to come in as a career coach in what I do to this day, of help people kind of make that flip to, I should be following this certain linear path. This is what my working parenthood should look like to, no, what could it look like? And how could I do this differently?

Dr. Ashley Blackington (05:05.88)

Yeah. And I think so often, like when you go from, once your kids get into that school age, you're, there's so many things that are, that maybe were a little more flexible prior to that, that are now so, so like a line in the sand, right? Like it's, you have, you've run into all of these really solid time boundaries. And that's not to say like everyone who doesn't have kids in school yet has these time boundaries, because we all do. But I just feel like there's something, like that transition into formal school, like kindergarten age, is like, okay, now we're not in that, we're not in the daycare or the preschool or the nanny or the au pair, whatever it is. Like, this is the schedule that we have for the next 13 years of like school starts here and it ends here. And I feel like that maybe I don't know. I feel like for me, I know for me that was like, okay, I have this many hours in the week where like my oldest is gone. And I have this many hours where I we are all together as a family and like I left my clinical job. When my oldest went into kindergarten, because I was working on the weekend, and I was like, well, if I keep if I do this, instead of the side job that I had started or company I created, I was like, I'm never gonna see her because I will be gone or she will be gone and I got to do this now and like it's oh my god it's so scary it's so scary I'm going to go ahead and turn it off.

Becca Carnahan (07:07.583)

Yeah. But it was really, it sounds like for both of us, it was really intentional saying, now that we're entering this new season of life, let me go back and revisit an exercise I do with my coaching clients, their career criteria. What are the things that matter most to you in this new season of life? And yes, it's related to the work piece of it. Yes, it's related to how much money you need to be bringing in. But it's also just how do you want to be spending your days? Who are the people that you want to be spending the most time with? How can you fit all of these different pieces together to be intentional about your choices? I think that kindergarten transition is a big one for a lot of people because your finances may be changing a bit. Going from daycare to a public school, if that's the choice that works best for your family, your time changes a lot.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (07:52.491)

Mm-hmm.

Becca Carnahan (08:06.735)

At the same time, you're also just watching your kids explore the world at that age. They're exploring their own interests. They're getting excited about things. I think it stirs something up for us as parents. Like, oh, do I still get to do that too? Can I still be curious about what brings me joy? Can I explore the world a little bit more than I have because I've been in this baby haze for a while? Do I have a little bit more freedom now to explore and I think for many people the answer is yes.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (08:36.951)

Yeah, and I think too, like it's you watch your kid go and do this thing, right? Where like, you know, if they've been in a preschool program for a couple of years, or they've been in daycare, like they know everything to them is very known. And now it's this huge jump and you're like standing there trying to help this little tiny person make this big, huge jump. And I feel like for, I feel like for me, it was like, well, I'm asking this little tiny person cause they're so small.

to like go in here and go do these things and go learn and grow and all of that. And like right now they may be really nervous or really scared and it's like, well, I am. So maybe, maybe I should just do this too. Like maybe when am I ever gonna get less scared? Like never, never.

Becca Carnahan (09:21.711)

Never. That's such a good point. When am I ever gonna, I think it's such a good phrasing too. When will I be less scared? And the answer is probably never. And it's okay to have some of that fear going into a change. I think you can look at fear as a motivator. You can look at fear as an opportunity to say, what am I scared of? What are the questions I need to get answers to? How can I approach this from a really proactive way instead of just sitting with the fear?

Dr. Ashley Blackington (09:33.032)

Yeah, yeah. And that like positive approach to fear. Like I think, you know, that people say, fear is there to protect you and all of that stuff. But it's also the protective piece is to keep you in the known versus the unknown. And how do things change if you stay in the known? You have to go and do the thing. Jump, fly, whatever, you know, whatever the phrase is. Yeah.

Becca Carnahan (10:17.335)

Yes. Mm-hmm. Yep, exactly.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (10:21.206)

So how about, so how do people, I was gonna say, how do people find this? Like when you have a new client come in, what are, are there like a sort of common things that people come to you with or common, I wanna say like common industry, like are people in this sort of track and they're like, no, no thank you. Like is there, are there similarities that you've noticed in the time that you've had clients come in.

Becca Carnahan (10:49.679)

Mm-hmm. Yeah. So I'd say the most common, it's across industries. I do see a certain, we'll talk about that in terms of the certain industries and types of styles that I will often see, but this theme cuts across that people will come to me and say, Becca, I've been doing this thing for the past, let's say 10 years. And 10 years is a pretty common inflection point actually. 10, 15 years. I'm not sure if I want to be doing this for the next 20 years. And 20 years is a long time. When I look ahead to the next chapter of my career, there's actually more career ahead than there is behind. And it's scary to think about doing this exact thing for that long. And it's not fitting my life anymore. I'm not as excited about it anymore. It's not as interesting to me.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (11:24.535)

Yeah.

Becca Carnahan (11:46.199)

I'm feeling really stuck, really scared that I have carved out a path for myself that doesn't fit anymore. What do I do? And for some people, they'll go to a career coach and say, like, hey, help me with my resume. And that's great that there's career coaches who really specialize in doing the resume and having a targeted search. Where people come to me first is that they just don't really know what they wanna do. They know it's not this. They know this isn't working.

but they're not exactly sure what that next step looks like. So that's where I love to dive in with people and say, yeah, let's start there. Let's start at the foundation of figuring out where your career sweet spot is now because your life has changed, your skills have evolved, your interests have changed. Where's your now career sweet spot? What are your now career and life criteria? And then with all of that great data about you, now we can explore what those next steps are.

whether that is entrepreneurship, whether that is a job search, whether that is crafting your existing role, or looking for a bridge job that helps you to change industries or change functions. There's so many different paths forward, but we need that foundational stuff first, getting that good data about you. To your question earlier about industries, I think a lot of people will come to me from a helper industry, I'll call it. So there have been teachers, they've been in the healthcare field, they've been in non-profit, and they've been really heart-centered in their work, and that was what was driving them for a long time. And now it's not that they aren't heart-centered anymore, they just want to be, they have different things that they also care about in their career and life. And how do I take some of this heart-centeredness about me and explore it in a different way?

Dr. Ashley Blackington (13:41.15)

Yeah. I also wonder because those careers teaching healthcare, I mean, for a lot of different strands of healthcare, not all healthcare, and nonprofit, the pay is not there.

Becca Carnahan (13:58.435)

That's part of it.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (14:11.186)

And those industries are dominated by women. And I wonder if it's that idea of I did this, I poured out, I helped others, I did the thing, and I have a family to raise, and I have all of these skills, it's time to get paid for what I know how to do and what I'm good at doing. Because when my kids were little and I was on maternity leave or I was working part-time or whatever, the people that I...

saw all the time that people that I hung out with, my friends were working for nonprofits, were in healthcare and were teachers. And it was that age old argument of like, well, I don't make enough money to make it worthwhile for me to find childcare at this level. Yeah, I mean, all this stuff is interconnected. Like you, I'm sure have like a total hand on the pulse of this. But I wonder what your thoughts are on that.

Becca Carnahan (15:08.527)

100%, 100%. I mean, money has to be part of this conversation because we can talk about what brings you most fulfillment in the activities that you enjoy and what sparks joy for you. But we're also talking about careers. We're talking about money and raising kids is expensive. And based on the number of snacks my kids eat alone, raising kids is expensive.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (15:14.733)

Mm-hmm and fruit.

Becca Carnahan (15:38.187)

We need to look at making sure that your needs are being met from a financial situation right now, but also planning for the future. And if you're going down a career path that the money isn't there, that's not going to meet your family's needs, yeah, we need to look elsewhere. We need to figure out what's going to work best for you from the skills you want to use, your interest areas, and then who is going to pay you.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (15:47.918)

Mm-hmm.

Becca Carnahan (16:06.055)

And that doesn't mean you have to, you don't have to stay in the path that you chose when you were 18 or 22. It might've worked for you for a period of time, but I have seen so many people make transitions. This is absolutely possible to make a transition into a career that's going to have a higher pay scale and also just be a better fit for your life at this stage too.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (16:29.482)

Yeah, yeah, because that the option to go back into or to continue on in an industry where you are pouring out. And then at home, you are also pouring out. I wonder if how that balance also plays into it. I mean, I think that the money aspect is something that we really have to talk more about, especially in those fields, and especially in the fact that they are female dominated, but also the energy and the social component and the emotional component of that. It's like, keeps scraping the bottom of the bucket and it's still empty.

Becca Carnahan (16:42.551)

Yep, and what a lot of people will say to me too is like, okay, I know I need to make a change, but I'm having a hard time grabbing any amount of time or energy for myself to make this change because I'm exuding all this energy at work, I'm giving all my energy at home. It feels selfish, that's the word that comes up, feels selfish to take something for me to figure out my next direction. And I'd like to reframe that and say it's actually

It's the opposite of selfish because if you're able to carve out that time for yourself right now to figure out where you want to go next, to identify new paths forward, to tell your story, to network, to build connections that are going to help you make a move, just think about all the positive energy that you're going to be able to pour back into your family and the positive role model that you're going to be for your kids about showing that you can make a change, that you can find work that you really enjoy. So it's about the money, but it's also about energy and being intentional about these next steps, asking for help through these next steps and carving out a bit of time. I know it feels super hard, but carving out a bit of time to figure it out so that you can make that move.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (18:23.278)

Yeah, yeah, agreed. And I think, yeah, like, you know, we are, I feel like our generation of parents, maybe our, so our grandparents, right, they worked, you get that job when you're 18, and you work there, and then you get the watch or like, you know, whatever the plaque and stuff like that. But then our parents sort of started to transition out of that, like, people would maybe, maybe move, maybe not necessarily have like a career change or career swing, but you wouldn't necessarily stay in that same job for decades and decades. Whereas our generation is pivots. We are the pivot generation because of all these systems that were in place that benefited our grandparents and maybe benefited our parents, but definitely do not benefit our generation. And so showing our kids a different way forward, I think is so cool. I mean, for lack of a, like, of a better term, I just think it's cool that, like, we're showing them that you don't have to stay where you thought you were. I mean, can you imagine if you had to live with all of your choices at 18 for the rest of your life?

Becca Carnahan (19:29.998)

Yeah. Ashley, I think about that all the time and I use the jeans analogy. If I let the 18-year-old version of myself pick out the jeans I was gonna wear for the rest of my life, like, oh no, oh sweetheart. So if I am not going to let denim preferences be something that I'm going to let my teenage self decide, my word, I can't let my career choices be dictated by a teenager. As much as I love and respect the teenager, that she was at the time. That's not who I am right now. That's 20 years ago.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (20:19.43)

Right. And she also is not, she also didn't know what you know now. Yeah.

Becca Carnahan (20:24.863)

Exactly. She'd be so mad. Honestly, if you looked at, I think this is a really good exercise for people to like pretend that you're like looking next to you at your 18 year old self and you're telling her, no, you decided that you wanted to be in education at 18 and you decided that you wanted to wear those low, low rise jeans. So that's what we do forever. Now. Can you imagine the look that she would give you be like, are you for real right now?

I can just imagine the eye roll. So I think you can love and respect the 18 year old version of yourself that made some choices at a certain time while also knowing that she would want to support you in changing and growing.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (21:06.346)

Yeah, I mean, because even your 18 year old self has already gone through how many transitions. And it's just this idea that like you reach a certain age, whatever that may be, or a certain stage, like you have kids and now you just like pause your own growth and development because you're a nurturer, caregiver, whatever. Like how does that even make sense? Like my 18 year old self would be like, hard pass. Hard pass on that.

Becca Carnahan (21:10.847)

Exactly. Yeah. There's this imaginary line that we draw for ourselves around what's grown up and what's not grown up. And I just don't think that... I think that line is exactly... I think it's imaginary. And when you look around you, it's easy to think that, okay, at a certain age and stage, I need to be just kind of doing the same thing, coasting along for a while. But when you really look around and see other people that have made transitions, people who are doing other interesting things in their career. There's a lot more examples out there of people making pivots, people exploring new paths forward. So when you kind of take the blinders off and say like, there's other options out there. I can keep growing up. I can keep changing and evolving. That's a very freeing feeling.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (22:25.306)

Yeah, yeah, I say to my kids all the time, like, I don't know what I want to be when I grow up. And they're like, but you're like, Mom, and I'm like, yeah. But like, why, like, why do I have to stop now? Like, why can't that's why there's continuing education. That's why there's entrepreneurship. That's why there's all of these things. So do you do you have when people come in, so if you have a sort of similar ish track of people that are in these caregiving, externally focused kind of careers, and then they come in and work with you. Are there sort of popular ways forward? Like, do you notice a shift in transition where there's similarities that like, not necessarily every teacher becomes a this after we work together, but like, what sort of similar directions, if any, do you find that people head in after they work with you?

Becca Carnahan (23:22.983)

Yeah, I'd say one common theme is looking at mission-driven companies that aren't necessarily nonprofits. So let me give you an example. So a company that is perhaps more in the, like, the ed tech space, they're really committed to education, but they're doing more like tech-enabled work and they're building partnerships with schools. That's an example of one.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (23:34.008)

Yeah.

Becca Carnahan (23:51.747)

People who I've seen go into more of the, again, this is like health tech, tech enabled, mission driven, for profit organizations. But besides the tech of it all, of this tech enabled types of businesses, it's really looking at companies who share their values and actually those values are played out too. So it's not just on paper in that career criteria that I mentioned earlier is figuring out what are some of your non-negotiables around your values and motivators. And then with that in mind, what questions do you need to be asking other companies so that you can really make sure that this is a fit there. Because so many of the people that I talked to who are caregivers, they're helpers, they're heart-centered, they have some really strong values that they want to see exemplified by the company that they work for next.

So let's ask the questions. Let's not just take it on face value that the company says we're family focused. Great, what does that mean? Give me an example. We don't need to be antagonistic. Be like, what does it mean? That's how it's on your website. But you can go in and talk with people in informational conversations and networking and say, I was really excited when I saw on your website that the company is really focused on being family friendly. I wonder if you can share with me what your experience has been in terms of how that value is integrated throughout the organization. It's a more nuanced question than what's the culture like here. But a lot of what we're doing is a culture search and finding companies that share values support their people. And maybe you're not doing the exact same.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (25:32.404)

Yeah.

Becca Carnahan (25:46.035)

Maybe you're not a teacher in this setting, but you're using some of your same skills around learning and development, instructional design, training, those types of things that you can transition into working for a company that shares some of the same mission and vision that you do for the impact that you want to make in the world.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (26:05.95)

Yeah. Do you also find that people when they transition into something, into something new, that they are much more assertive in formal policy that exists in the company?

Becca Carnahan (26:18.2)

Mm-hmm. In terms of asking about the formal policy about the company, or just want to make sure I understand.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (26:24.638)

About like, yeah, like about caregiving or about like leave and about like things like that. Because I feel like the companies now because if you have somebody that is in this career transition, because they have run into either like, I don't like my job because I don't feel fulfilled. But I also don't like my job because I have all of these other responsibilities now, like I have children or aging parents or whatever it is. And I work for a company that does not either doesn't have policy in place, tells us one thing, but there's nothing tangible that I can see or use to benefit from. Do you have people that when they move from that space into companies that have these formal policies and all of that, like, do you find that happening more and more?

Becca Carnahan (27:13.891)

people are definitely very intentional about what they're looking for. So if in the needs bucket of your career and life criteria, there's something that you have specified around, yes, it's salary, but also certain benefits that are important to you, let's do the research and find out directly from the company, but also be doing research on websites, talking with other people and seeing not just what the policy is, but how it is put into practice. It's perfectly okay to ask the hard questions. I know it feels a little scary to be asking some of these hard questions. And I think we're taught early on to be like, I'm a hard worker, you want me, like, and that's true, but you are interviewing a company just as much as they are interviewing you. This is a big deal. And this is a professional relationship that you're getting into. And yes, you want them to pick you,

Dr. Ashley Blackington (27:45.11)

Yes. And I think people forget that.

Becca Carnahan (28:10.483)

Do you want to pick them? This is a choice that you're making too. So making sure that you get your questions answered before you're ever accepting a role, I am huge on that. Let's make sure we get all those questions answered. And this can also be true of proposing a new role within your existing organization. Maybe your existing organization does have some really good policies in place, but the skills that you're using aren't well aligned or the team that you're on just is not well aligned. Let's get intentional about proposing a new role or networking internally and asking questions, seeing how work is done in other ways. How could you do work in different ways? I think the overall theme of this is intentionality and using our words. Like we tell our kids all the time, use your words, please. We're going to be using our words here as adults and making sure that we're using the right word that get our questions answered.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (29:11.774)

Yeah. And I like the idea of it also having the option on the table or people not feeling like I don't like what I'm doing right now. Therefore, I have to leave this, leave this, leave this, leave this. It's that you're also saying, how about we, we don't just sort of like burn the whole bridge down or walk away, just say, is there, is there a way that things can grow and change within the role that I already do? So that, I mean,

Maybe that feels, I'm sure that feels a lot less scary depending on what you're doing than like starting all the way over. Like maybe it's, maybe you have a project idea or maybe something, whatever it is. I like that. I think that's cool. Yeah.

Becca Carnahan (29:49.847)

And that's not the forever decision, but it can be a really great next decision. So I can think of three people in our Career Clarity program right now who are doing exactly this, that are proposing something else for themselves internally that is going to bring them so much more fulfillment. When they did the exercise of finding where their sweet spot was and what they really needed, there was a match in some ways with their existing company, but in some place there was a miss.

So instead of like you said, just burning it down and saying like, I need to go fire off 20 resumes to other companies and hope and cross my fingers that it's better over there. Let's see what other options can exist within an already good environment. It says, let's move a good to a great, let's move a fine to a good. And allow you to create that bridge for yourself that's going to allow you to make another move later on because now you have further developed your skills, or you have a schedule that works for your life, or you're able to bring more energy back into your work, back into your home life, and back into this whole idea of continuing to grow up and pursue your continued professional development.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (31:01.95)

Yeah, for sure. What does, so for you personally, what does that, what does it look like for you now that you have made this jump and now that you have your four years into like, I'm assuming that when you were at Harvard, it's a go into the office and you're there from, you know, like eight or nine to five, six, whatever it is. And what does that, how has that changed for you and what does that look like?

Becca Carnahan (31:06.584)

Yeah. So my workday is very different now. I work fully from home, which I love, and I get my kids on the bus in the morning. I go and work out. I come back to my desk. Usually it's like 9.30, and I'm at my desk in my office. Sometimes I wear in sweatpants or leggings more often. And just doing the work that... I love the variety that my work brings now is that when I look at my workday talking with really interesting people, I'm spending time writing and creating. I am doing some of the technical sides of running a business too. So I had to do a little bit of taxes later, which isn't super exciting, but there's a lot of variety that's happening in my day. And I love that. And also by the time my kids are getting off the bus, I am opening the door for them, seeing how their day was, talking with them and I'm pretty much done with my work for the day.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (32:10.891)

Yeah.

Becca Carnahan (32:27.363)

So being able to take out the commute on either end of it and really focus my work on a lot of one-to-one interactions, some small group interactions, and doing a lot of writing and creating, that brings me a lot of joy. And the fact that there is so much variety in my work keeps me engaged because I know that when I was doing an exercise for myself of what kind of business I'd wanna create, what kind of career I wanted to have, having enough variety.

and control over what that variety looks like was huge to me. So I tell people too, I don't know if this is going to be the exact same business in several years from now. You know what? It's probably going to evolve because I'm going to allow myself permission to evolve the business, to see where the needs are in the people that I love working with and really reflect on the skills that I like to be using, what skills I want to be using the most in that season of life maybe it shifts a little bit, and that's exciting rather than scary.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (33:01.251)

Mm-hmm. Yeah, yeah, I think that like that fear is not all bad. You know, excitement is not all bad. And you know, it's that like everything is gray versus black and white is really a helpful way to look at things. So you do you do a ton of writing you wrote a book and you have your own podcast as well. So tell me tell me more about those please and thank you.

Becca Carnahan (33:36.642)

I do, yeah. Yeah. So my podcast and my book have the exact same name actually. So When Mommy Grows Up is the name of the podcast and When Mommy Grows Up is the name of the book. And it's really a lot of the same idea in the book and the podcast. It's about incorporating stories and humor into this really kind of heavy topic of career development. When you think about going to, if you put yourself back in that 18 year old shoes, were you super excited about going to talk to the the Career Services Office. No, not really. That was kind of felt like a scary, like heavy step and that's still the same now as adults be like, oh, this is kind of a heavy topic. I'd love to be able to infuse stories and humor and parenting into these conversations because it makes it more relatable. It makes it more accessible to people.

In When Mommy Grows Up, I co-host with my friend and colleague, Marie, and we talk to each other about kind of real life stories. We change some names and details of people that we've worked with within the Career Clarity Program, people I've seen through one-to-one coaching, and share those stories and how we can help people work through some of these similar inflection points. And then we also bring on guests too who share more about their career inflection points, who are also parents have been able to make some changes in their career and share advice with other parents about how they can be thinking about making some changes in their career. So that's with the podcast. And then the book actually is, so it came out in 2021 and we have a new distributor. So that's getting a new cover recently, which I'm really excited about.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (35:42.815)

Yay!

Becca Carnahan (35:48.975)

Yeah, so that's fun. So we're gonna have you go like republishing when mommy grows up coming out later this year, which is exciting. And it's a lot of the same thing of pulling in stories and I bring in a lot of, I'm a proud millennial mom, so there's a lot of 90s nostalgia humor in this as well. And a lot of stories that I shared from when my kids were little, lessons that I was trying to teach them as they were in that toddler and preschool stage.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (36:03.279)

Yeah.

Becca Carnahan (36:15.203)

But when you reflect on it, those really are similar lessons that we can infuse back into our career, like making new friends and using your words and sharing with the people around you. There's so many ways we can take those same lessons and flip them back over into how we can continue to develop in our careers.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (36:23.374)

Yeah, it's that notion of what is it? Everything I needed to know I learned in kindergarten about making friends and trying new things and all of that. I think, yeah, that's really important. It's really important for us as parents to remember and it's also really important for us as people, I think, to remember is like, we are consistently changing and growing.

Becca Carnahan (36:40.611)

Oh yeah.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (37:04.002)

Yeah. So when you are having somebody come on that is new when you have a new client, what does the process look like for you to bring in a new client?

Becca Carnahan (37:12.811)

Yeah. So a lot of the clients that we work with are coming to us in through the career clarity program, which is a group community program where people are working through these really core four stages of career development. So uncovering their career sweet spot, crafting their career criteria, exploring new steps, new paths forward. And that's through some research but also through networking and building connections and then pitching themselves and their story. How do you pull all these different pieces together, connect the dots of your career story so you can share it with someone else? So we work with people through those four stages, through these lessons and activities, we do a lot of like written activities and things like that to help people through. And then one of my favorite parts is when people can come together in our group coaching conversations too. And we have small group coaching sessions where people are coming and they're asking questions and they're learning from each other. And I can sit directly with them just like this and be like, all right, tell me where you're getting stuck and let's get unstuck to move forward. So that's where a lot of my coaching happens is within that career clarity program. And then I also work with some people one-to-one too, which is a really great part of my work that I get to also spend a full hour at a time with people and work with them through the same process.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (38:43.422)

Mm-hmm. I think that's important. The group piece is important because it's like that idea of like, I have to stay where I'm where I am right now. Otherwise, like all is bad. But when you get into a group or community where other people are still are feeling that way and making that transition themselves, I think that's a really important opportunity for people to say like, oh, I did this and you're doing this. And how does that all how can we all bounce off of each other in a good way?

Becca Carnahan (39:10.267)

Exactly. And that's exactly what happens. So even the folks that I work with one to one, they come into the groups too and are getting engaged in these conversations. And one of my favorite things we do is we celebrate Wednesday wins in the group. So we have kind of an online community too. And the engagement that happens through these Wednesday wins that when people are sharing about, because we tell them a Wednesday win is not just getting a new job offer. A Wednesday win is like pushing yourself out of your comfort zone, networking with someone new, proposing a new role, having a kind of scary conversation with a manager that you pushed yourself to do and it worked out really well. It's my favorite day of the week in the program because I just get to, people are just like, oh my gosh, like this happened and this happened and I'm so proud of myself. And we don't often do that as busy parents, busy professionals. We don't often stop and celebrate the wins.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (39:46.455)

Yeah.

Becca Carnahan (40:09.683)

We just tell ourselves that, oh, I could have been doing this better or my to-do list, I didn't get this done. We're really hard on ourselves. And if we can pause and celebrate the steps that we're taking forward, it makes such a huge difference for people that momentum and the energy that they can bring to their work, to their family, it's huge. So for everyone out there listening, if you don't already have a practice of celebrating Wednesday wins. I think it's a really good one to help you keep moving forward.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (40:43.09)

Yeah, and yeah, I mean, I think too, like even especially as a parent, like, I remember being like, it is seven o'clock and everyone's in bed, like that's a win right there. You know what I mean? It's like that, even if it's a small thing, that's really not a small thing. But whatever, whatever it is, whatever sort of keeps you moving forward, momentum keeps you keeps you in that in that positive space, no matter how big or small it is.

Becca Carnahan (40:52.769)

Yes, putting on real pants in a day is a win. We tell people showing up, getting 15 minutes to yourself is a win. Like these are all things that do make a difference. So let's celebrate them.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (41:14.862)

Whew, that's a big day.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (41:23.054)

Mm-hmm. I love that. So for people that are listening that are maybe sitting in their car or like have their headphones in who are like, oh, wait a minute. I think that maybe I don't want to do the thing I do anymore. And now I want things to be differently. How how do people what are your suggestions for where people start? And then we'll start there. First question that one. Yeah.

Becca Carnahan (41:50.039)

Yeah, yes. Yeah, yeah. So one of the very first things that I invite people to do, and first of all, if you're feeling that way, come talk with me. Let's have this conversation and then keep things moving. But one of the first activities that we do is to help people to reflect back on what they actually care about. And that seems like a big question, but we are going through the motions a lot in life and like checking things off the list.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (42:00.632)

Yeah.

Becca Carnahan (42:19.959)

So when I ask people to think about, what are you passionate about? What do you love? Sometimes they'll say, oh, hold up, I'm too busy to think about that. Like, I don't have passions. There's not things that I love. I'm like, well, that's not true. Let's sit and think about all the different things that you enjoy. What activities do you like doing with your kids? Not because they're having fun, but because you're enjoying it. What do you stop when you're scrolling on your phone? What do you stop and read? What podcasts do you listen to? What do you like talking about with your friends when you have two minutes, what types of memes are you sending them, those types of things. And then trying to find the through line between where some of your interests intersect with what really does bring you a lot of joy. And that can be what is reflected as your passion. So asking yourself some of these simple questions is a good way to sort of revisit yourself as a person, not just as a parent and professional. It's who am I, what do I love? I think that's a really good jumping off point and it's really fun. It's one of the first things that we do when we welcome people into the Career Clarity Program is like, yeah, let's start with some of this fun stuff. Let's figure out who you are. And then we can build from there.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (43:35.274)

Yeah, I mean, I couldn't agree more with this is why this podcast exists, right? It's, it's this idea of like, what do you, what is for you in alongside what is for everybody else? And I think that there's so much, especially when you have really young kids or you are, you know, you're in a job that is really demanding, but there's also, it doesn't feel like there's time for a transition or you are, I mean, especially in the early stages of parenthood where it is that it has to be mechanical in a way because there are so many things that need to get done and there is so much there's so much structure that comes from like feeding and napping and you know activities and appointments and all of that stuff where it's like it's really easy to get on that treadmill of like the next thing we're gonna do is this and this and this and this and this and being the facilitator way above and beyond being a participant and having, yeah, having that step back to say, if I were to be a participant in this life instead of facilitator of life, what would that look like for me?

Becca Carnahan (44:37.815)

Yeah, exactly. What would it look like? What are the little moments that you already are participating? Because you are, even if it doesn't feel like you have three hours of your day to go for the hike, do the yoga class, do the thing that you really love to do, what do you find even in these micro moments? What are you drawn to? Because that is you participating. So let's give yourself some credit for the fact that you're making some intentional choices to participate in things that, entertainment, things that are exciting, interesting to you, even in micro moments. And that can allow you some different language to talk about what do you want to make some more time for.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (45:33.386)

I like that. Yeah, it's the expanding upon, and maybe it does start with a little teeny tiny pebble of something and how that moves forward. So if people are sitting here, standing, walking, whatever you're doing when you're listening, if you are in forward motion, how, and people are like, this is what I feel like I need to have a conversation, I want to do this. So how do people get in touch with you and where do people find you?

Becca Carnahan (46:03.059)

Yeah, the best way is to head over to my website. So it's next That's where you'll find all kinds of stuff. That's the way we can set up time to talk to each other. There's a fun little quiz on there too about the just right job match quiz. You'll see it right there on the front. So some really good ways for us to start to have a conversation. So next and then if you want to find me, I'm always on LinkedIn too. LinkedIn is my favorite for my social media perspective. So it's just my name, Becca Carnahan on LinkedIn. Come find me there and let's keep the conversation going.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (46:40.21)

I love it. I'm a big convert to LinkedIn as of lately. I feel like there's, it's a lot, it's like you're getting to the point there. And I, yeah, so LinkedIn, I will, I'm going to find you on LinkedIn because.

Becca Carnahan (46:53.731)

Let's talk on LinkedIn. I'm on LinkedIn all the time. It's a good platform. I love to write, like you mentioned. So being able to share content and tips and tools and conversation on LinkedIn, I think is such a great platform for it. And you're going to find a lot of really interesting ways to use LinkedIn too if you don't already. It's not just a job board. It's a way to build connections, a way to do research, a way to explore those new paths forward without spending all day scrolling on a job board. So that's my pitch for LinkedIn. Come find me there and we'll talk.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (47:23.787)

Yeah.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (47:31.054)

Yeah, you're in the right zone. The career lady woman is in the right career space. So you should, I, you've got it. You got it nailed down. Well, thank you so much for joining me today. And I will put all of your info, contact things in the show notes, but I love what you're doing and thank you for coming on.

Becca Carnahan (47:34.887)

Yes. Thanks for having me.