Full Episode Transcript

Dr. Ashley Blackington (00:01.378)

Hello and welcome back to the AND/BOTH podcast. I am here today with Jenn Klein, who has a really cool business that I can't wait for her to tell you all about. She is the founder of You Are a Philanthropist, which I love the title of, and the book Giving is Selfish. So I wanted to say welcome and thank you for being here.

Jenn Klein (00:25.43)

Thank you so much for having me, Ashley.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (00:28.058)

Yeah, it's great. So I would love to just if you don't mind introducing yourself and telling the listeners a little bit about who you are and what you do and then we'll go from there.

Jenn Klein (00:39.598)

So my name is Jen Klein. I am the founder and CEO of You Are a Philanthropist and the author of Giving is Selfish that just I published in October. And really my mission is to spread the awareness about the joy of giving and the health benefits of giving and how beneficial it is to give back to our families, our communities, and the greater world.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (01:11.058)

I love it. So when you say giving, are you talking about time, financial? Like does it, is it anything and everything or is it specific?

Jenn Klein (01:20.758)

For me, in my experience as a fundraiser in 20 years, I would call it anything and everything, but I do know that specifically in science there's something called the helper's high. And that is when you give mostly of your time as a volunteer. So it can, you know, volunteering can lower your blood pressure, can even help you live longer and overall you have better mental health benefits, better community connections. So I think it's something we don't talk enough about in our society and I kind of found this niche because I was a mother for eight years but also wanting to stay in my career of fundraising. So I started exploring and blogging about giving, added a health coaching certification on top of that, and became really curious about talking to people who through my podcast, You Are A Philanthropist, that were doing this charitable work and who are not being recognized and really seeing the value in what they were telling me, which is that it feels good to give, which is why I call my book, Giving is Selfish.

And giving is selfish is actually titled after something that Denzel Washington said in a commencement speech. I thought he was, I thought I misunderstood because I thought he said giving is selfless. That was something I had always believed on my own that when you're giving, you're giving so much of yourself. But what I learned from him is that it feels really good to give and of all the successes that he's had in his life, his ultimate success was really helping people through charitable foundations and volunteering.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (03:23.538)

I love that. So I like that, too, that you talk about it being not just like a financial piece, although your background is in fundraising, that it's about time as well. Because I think that when people, when you hear the word philanthropy, or you hear about, you know, charitable acts, or the things like things along those lines, that people think, well, it's all financial.

So it's the idea that you are, I mean, like the time is money phrase, right? It's like if you are not in a position to be doing these big things or little things, that your time is just as important or just as valuable to a cause or an organization or things like that. So that's, I think that's really cool.

Jenn Klein (04:15.587)

Yeah, it's, in my belief, it's just as you said, I think the society's definition of a philanthropist is somebody who can give millions, and for the average American, we're not able to attain that ability. But I want people to be really assured of what they are able to do and encouraged about what they can contribute. And that's why in my podcast, It's just people like myself who are giving to their local food pantry or giving back through their children's sports programs. So I think it's important to amplify those voices who are not recognized.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (05:01.97)

It's like the silent good deeds kind of thing of people that are really making it possible, the smaller tasks that make it possible for these bigger wheels to keep turning. Yeah. And so you are a mom. This is how we found each other. And how old are your kids? How many kids do you have?

Jenn Klein (05:15.286)

Absolutely. I have two boys, eight and six.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (05:28.042)

Okay, that's a busy age. It is a busy age. So how do you how do you do the things that you do alongside of being having kids that I assume are in elementary school, and it's February and everyone is, you know, various states of colds and all of that. So how do you find the time? How do you how does it look like for you on a day to day basis?

Jenn Klein (05:30.238)

It is. Well, I tell people I don't watch TV anymore, which is flat out true. I spend the day working as a major gift officer for a Catholic school. Then I pick up my kids and watch them and take care of them for a few hours after school. And then after they go to bed, I'm working my business. So this is a passion of mine and something I do late into the evenings, really because it's a joy for me. And usually when I do my volunteer work, either for the food pantry or for the sports activities my children are involved with, I'm able to bring my kids with me and have them involved as well, which is a nice way to show them about how important giving back is as well.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (06:49.686)

Yeah, I was gonna say it's one thing to say, it's a really good thing to do this, but to be able to show and model that for your kids by having them come along with you and for having them see you have this goal in mind of starting writing a book, publishing a book, that's no small feat for sure. And then being able to see you go through the process of that as a great example.

Jenn Klein (07:17.282)

Thank you. Yes, they are very excited about my book. They can't read it yet, but they love the fact that I wrote a book.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (07:27.75)

Yeah, I think that's cool. And so when you are, when did you start You are a philanthropist? How long has that been going?

Jenn Klein (07:36.618)

I started blogging about eight years ago when I left my fundraising job and became a full-time mom. That just developed where people were curious about what I was doing. Someone recommended I do a podcast, which is how my podcast got started. Then I started the process of writing a book about a year and a half ago. It just evolved. I was getting feedback, positive feedback, and I just went with it.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (08:12.702)

Mm hmm. I love it. And it seems like everything has come through really organically. Like it's not like you hit the ground running, because two, I think that people listening that are interested in starting something that is a passion project or they are wanting to pursue something that, you know, it's still in its infancy in terms of like how they're thinking about it. It's like when you see someone else who started a business and it's like, there's a podcast and there's a book and there's like that big list, it feels like this is the thing I have to do. But it's just like what you're saying about philanthropy and giving time is that just start with a little bit and then build on it from there.

Jenn Klein (08:55.374)

You are so right. It was definitely very organic and it was exciting that people were responding to my message and I just continued to have a growth mindset for myself and learn from, you know, learn new things based on my conversations with my guests on my podcast. And it's been really exciting to learn new perspectives of philanthropy. If your listeners were to tune into my podcast, there are some wonderful things that people say. There's a director of development who says he likes to activate generosity. And he doesn't see himself as pulling teeth to try to get people involved in the organization, but really inspiring people to get energized for what they can do with their time and money.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (09:52.594)

Yeah. And so have you in the eight years that you've been doing the blogging piece and really speaking about the importance of this, have you noticed changes in trends or trends in general, I guess?

Jenn Klein (10:07.298)

The interesting thing that I learned was that a lot of the folks on my podcast had a role model that was really influential in their life. So it could be a parent, it could be a family friend, but they very specifically talked about someone who when they were a child really role modeled giving back in some capacity. And that was interesting to me. It wasn't something I had thought about. It just goes back to show how important your role models, how important as mothers and parents we are as role models. And I find it exciting because it shows how important community is as well.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (10:53.402)

Yeah, I when you're talking about that, I think about my aunt, I'm Canadian. So aunt. But she has volunteered for the Special Olympics in Canada for I don't even know how many years, but she did it. And she would bring her boys with her. And then, you know, like as their teenagers, and then they get older, and they're just they're a part of it. And she's a part of it. And she, I really, I wish I knew how long she's done it for, but it's just one of those things. Like it's always a part of her day, you know, on Saturday morning, it's swimming or bowling or whatever, part of a huge piece of her life. And it's been really cool because now she has grandchildren and her grandchildren can go and see and they, like, it's just, it's like when people have, I don't know, it's like when people have like a hobby or a sport or whatever that family does, this is just like such a cornerstone piece of her life. And so she, through her own example for her children and then her grandchildren, and like has pulled friends in over the years to help and made great friends and things like that. So, I mean, that's for me what I think of when you're talking about the process and how you just start with one person and then it'll fan out from there.

Jenn Klein (12:15.982)

And I love the legacy that she can give to her own family and the impact that that's having. So when I became a mother, I started and I wrote about this in my book.

I started to kind of lose myself in service to my kids, and then I realized, wait a minute, I need to take care of myself too. And so I call it this giving scale. Like you have to kind of balance your self-care with giving to others because you can't pour from an empty cup, as they say. And the work we do at home is so important as well.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (12:45.474)

Yeah, that was my next question. You've led us all the way down the pathway. We're walking next to each other. So when you talk about philanthropy and giving of time and things like that, how does that match up with a job like motherhood where it is giving for so much of it? And so how do people who are all encompassed in

usually I would say like the earlier phases of motherhood where there's a lot of physical requirements and things like that. And then also too, as they get older, there's more of an emotional piece. How do you, how do you not define how do you sort of rectify that with this job where there's so much external and then giving as a way to fill the cup? Like how does that, how does that mesh for you?

Jenn Klein (13:48.654)

So for me, I think mothers are philanthropists. They're giving back to that next generation. They're putting their time, energy, passion into making the world a better place in their own homes. And so they're serving by cooking, cleaning, doing the dishes, running the errands, you know, and it's so important and so undervalued. And I wish that society would

you know, recognize that important work. And I think that's what I'm trying to do is really help mothers feel encouraged and empowered with what they are able to accomplish at home. And whether that be, you know, you have a job outside of your home, you know, whatever the right balance is for you, it's all, motherhood is all encompassing. So there's no getting around the demands of it.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (14:49.142)

Right, right. And then how do you balance? Like how about balancing that with a partner too, in order to free up that time to give back? How does that, is that part of the thinking and philosophy as well?

Jenn Klein (15:07.726)

I actually have men who are guests on my podcast as well and I love hearing their stories and I know that it's instrumental for them to be able to do community work if their partners are at home taking care of the inner work of their home. So I really see philanthropy as if you're married or you have a relationship that you are joined together in balancing the home and the community because one of them has to be home and one of them has to be out and about or could be out and about. And so there is this important partnership with your partner.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (15:54.662)

Yeah, yeah, because we had a couple of I've had a couple of guests on and they talk about like, the notion of fair play and Eve Rotsky and that sort of more collaborative approach that has come that has come out in courses and books and things like that over the year and how that having the having the opportunity to take some of that stuff off of your plate would give you the time to pursue something that does really help you give back in a way that's meaningful to you.

Jenn Klein (16:33.198)

Absolutely, I think that's so important to remember that if we're home, we need to be doing good work and if we have the capacity to give outside the home, which is a challenge as well. But there's health benefits to it as we were talking about. So if you see it from a health perspective that this is going to help me feel better about myself, this is going to energize me, this is going to help me you know, physiologically benefit myself as well.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (17:08.939)

To do stuff in the home or out of the home?

Jenn Klein (17:11.99)

Well, I would say out of the home. In the home, I find very challenging for myself because it is a demanding job and you do need to balance your self-care in the home. For me personally, I find the homework harder than the community work. I don't know if everybody else feels that way.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (17:37.262)

I think there's a lot of people that would agree with that because it is such a thing that is central. Like it's a core, it's a lightning rod within ourselves. Cause I feel like when you're in the community, there's that separation where you can choose. And I say choose for lack of a better term, like there's a schedule or there's a starting and a stopping point. Whereas when you're home, I think every parent no matter who you are has said, I would like to stop for five minutes or I would like to take the day off. And the people that you are saying that to are like, mom, dad, like that doesn't happen. And you're just like, no, just like 10 minutes. And so I think that that, I agree that being able to have much more clear boundaries around your time and your effort for me would be a lot easier than you know, if someone's jumping on my bed at 5.30 in the morning.

Jenn Klein (18:41.236)

I can identify with that, yes.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (18:43.202)

Very strongly. Oh, I love it. So when you are thinking ahead to the future of this and where you would like this to go, I mean, your book is out, it's new. And so where what direction, speaking of the organic growth, like what direction do you want this to trend towards?

Jenn Klein (19:08.338)

So, my mission, something that I learned in doing my own research is that 25% of Americans volunteer every year and of the 75% who don't volunteer, 90% of them say they want to but they don't have the time. And so you can see that there's this interest and there's this knowing of how beneficial it is. But the ability to do that by their time is a hindrance. But for me, I like to say every other month I volunteer for my food pantry by going around for an hour and a half in my community and picking up bags from my neighbor's porches to deliver them for the food pantry. And that's what I do with my children. And it's not that much of my time. And it's making an impact in the community. There's, you know, dozens of other volunteers who are doing it on the same day, and we're bringing in thousands of pounds of donations and canned goods to the food pantry. So I get energized by something as simple as that. And I want people to know that there are opportunities out there. And I'm very curious, what more could we accomplish in the world if more of us were volunteering our time? and more of us were able to perceive that there is the time in some capacity. And it's up to, honestly, it's up to the nonprofits and the fundraisers out there to help people get involved too. We need to be, as a nonprofit professional, we need to be creating those opportunities to help people get involved and I'm going to be sharing some of the things that I've learned from the last couple of years. Thank you.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (20:57.77)

Yeah, I like what you're saying about it. It really sounds like so much of the work that you're doing is around reframing. So it's not like you're standing there saying, nobody volunteers and everybody needs to volunteer. And like, these are the very strict definitions of what it means to volunteer. You're saying, okay, so if you go to the, if you go to your food pantry and you do that, that doesn't mean.

that means that you've done that. And that's a clear way of saying I volunteered, right? There's an organization, they need help, you go help and you do that. But maybe if people have less of a constricted view on what counts as volunteering, then you start to open up the conversation around people, I guess I would say taking credit in a good way, not in a bad way, but giving themselves credit for what they are doing on a day-to-day basis versus saying like, oh, I can't volunteer because I don't have that hour and a half or I don't have that like Saturday morning or all of that. So therefore I can't volunteer. But they may very well be doing things along the way that are considered volunteering and just helping them understand that it doesn't all look one way.

Jenn Klein (22:16.66)

You're absolutely right. I just learned the other day on February 17th was Random Act of Kindness Day. There's another way where we don't have to necessarily be joined with a nonprofit and working together, but if we're just practicing kindness on the social media, for example, or when we go out to the store. I think those other unrecognized aspects of giving back should be amplified as well, and I've had guests on my show talk about those things, because I do feel that is also a part of philanthropy.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (22:56.062)

Yeah, yeah, it's really, you know, it's not all, it isn't all this A, B or C, it's a lot of different things. And so you are working now as a fundraiser, you said that's the day, and so you are elbow deep in the fundraising world and the philanthropy world.

Jenn Klein (23:11.499)

Yes. Yes, I call it fun-draising because I love it. It's fun.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (23:23.026)

That's awesome. And what do you, so outside of fundraising, outside of volunteering, all of those things, what do you do? What do you do for you outside of all of this?

Jenn Klein (23:31.902)

Oh, that's a great question. I do have a monthly massage membership that I make sure. I get my monthly massage. And I like to go for walks with my family. We just were on vacation up here in Massachusetts for February break and we did cross-country skiing and snowshoeing. So I like to spend time with my family in the outdoors as well.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (23:37.107)

Ooh, I like that. Yeah, that's nice. And then do you, so do you envision there being a time when you are a philanthropist becomes the, your nine to five? Is that, is that the eventual goal?

Jenn Klein (24:13.798)

Yes, that's my dream. I really love sharing the message about how fun and rewarding and beneficial it is for ourselves, for our communities, for the world to be doing more philanthropic work.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (24:32.231)

And so if someone was saying, you know, I would really like to get started with this, but I don't really know where to start. I feel like I don't have time. I feel like I don't even know where to begin. Like, where would you suggest that people look when they're they if they when they want to get started with that? Sorry, that was a word salad.

Jenn Klein (24:52.91)

That's such a great question and I always say start with what you're passionate about. So identify what areas am I skilled at, what areas am I most passionate about. So for me, I'm obviously skilled in fundraising and I like to give to mental health organizations in some capacity or poverty alleviation, food insecurity and those are my main passion that I like to pursue. So it could be anything that you enjoy. I like to ask the question to my podcast guests, what's your vision for a better world? So if you could answer that question, you might be able to find what you would want to change in the world and to make that difference yourself.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (25:47.754)

Yeah. And so would you suggest that people, so they go through that exercise and they're like, I would like to see change for animals, just because that's, I feel like that's one that we can maybe sort of have a little bit of definition around. But I don't have the time, but I don't have this. My kids are on break next week, so they had the SPCA, the local animal shelter come in and they had people, kids brought in food and things like that. So is there an opportunity for these organizations like the SPCA or food pantries or things like that to participate in this, in the education piece that you're talking about? Like reframing it to try and bring people in as volunteers.

Jenn Klein (26:42.382)

So a good nonprofit is never going to turn away a volunteer. So that's the good news is fundraisers, development offices love to involve volunteers in any capacity. And I think it's just that they love it, particularly when you call out of the blue and say, I want to help you. That's really exciting for a nonprofit. And my myself last year, we fostered a puppy just for a couple weeks and it was so fun and rewarding and it was a way that we could give back to an animal in need and it was a good lesson and we'll get a dog eventually but it was just a fostering opportunity for us.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (27:13.298)

Oh my god, how could you? I like, you know, I cannot, my kids have said this before, like, could we foster? And I'm like, no, because it's a one way street. Like you come in, and then you stay forever. I would be the poster for a foster fail we'd have there'd be dogs and there are already lots of kids and it would just be like, I can't I can't that is like, to me, that's one of those things that is so incredibly generous in so many ways because you've got, you have this, there's such an emotional lift when it comes to something like fostering in any way, shape or form. And then there's the emotional letting go, let down, sadness and all of that.

Jenn Klein (27:46.05)

A foster fail, they call it, yes. Yeah, I'm very impressed with people who foster often. And it was very rewarding for me to be involved with a local nonprofit who was doing that work. I just learned so much about their volunteer program and how passionate their volunteers are and how dedicated they are. I'm very impressed with the fostering program for animals.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (28:49.534)

Yeah, it's pretty, I think it's pretty cool. I love this statistic. I mean, I don't like the other end of it, but the one where people, when COVID was going on, that like animal shelters were empty because people were home and so they were taking on, I mean, some of it has swung back the other way, unfortunately, but like that idea of having all of these animals have homes to go to and people was a really nice feeling to hear about and read about.

Jenn Klein (29:18.142)

Absolutely, yeah. When I saw those little puppy eyes on Facebook, I was like, wow, that little one's coming home with me. I didn't even tell my husband.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (29:32.034)

I was looking at one of those animal, you know, the adoption shelter, they bring them up from the south and it was this dog named Pog the dog and I was on the phone and then I told him after I was like, Hey, I called but this dog was gone. And he's like, what dog are you talking about? I'm like, Oh, we almost got a dog this week. He's like, we already have a dog. I'm like, yes, but this dog was, it was speaking to me through social media. And he was like, no, I think it's time for you to put your phone down.

Jenn Klein (29:52.014)

Hahaha

Dr. Ashley Blackington (30:03.222)

I love it. So when you, I'm losing my questions. They're falling right out. It's, it is Friday. When you are thinking about ways to, like, would you ever do something in terms of like a matching platform or something like that? Like where you have people that match with organizations?

Jenn Klein (30:28.098)

Oh yes, that's a great idea. I haven't looked into that myself, but I do know there are organizations out there that will do that. And I remember when I used to search job boards, they even have volunteer opportunities on there. So there are certainly those organizations who will help you match with a non-profit or you can even just look on job boards.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (30:56.178)

Yeah, like I wonder if there's, you know, if you have people that are like, especially people that have really developed skill sets, if that is a way for them to be able to do something that's a little more structured, you know, where you're saying, I don't have time, but like, maybe there's an organization that wants an hour every other week or every month or whatever of someone to help them with that. And that's a way to find it. Just thinking of different ways for people to be able to find ways in that really align with what they do on a day-to-day basis.

Jenn Klein (31:27.41)

Yes, and actually, you know what? I'd like to tell your guests in the show notes about an organization that I can't think of off the top of my head that they could get started with.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (31:39.566)

Okay. Yeah, I love that. I would love to have just maybe some places to get started or things to look at for people that are saying, okay, I would like to, or that like you're saying, have wanted to do this for a very long time. And then it's one of those things that just sort of falls to the back of your mind with the lists and all of the things that are going on in the day-to-day side of living life these days. And so how people have a place like a jumping off point, as well as I would love for you to share all the information that you have in terms of like your book and your organization so that we can link people there so that they can say, all right, I'm a philanthropist now. Like I am putting on the hat and I'm gonna do it.

Jenn Klein (32:19.753)

Yes! That's...yes! Oh, I love that. That's my goal is to get the societal definition out of people's heads and just get active and get involved in either in your home or in your community in some capacity that makes sense for you.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (32:44.202)

Yeah, giving yourself credit, really. It's giving, yeah. Yeah, I think we're like, we are so hard on ourselves. Like it's that idea of like, I'm not doing enough, therefore it doesn't count. Like it's like an all or none. Like I either am giving hours and hours and hours of my time every week or every month, or it doesn't count. And what you're saying is like, a little bit goes a long way.

Jenn Klein (32:48.148)

Yes, absolutely.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (33:11.586)

I love it. All right, well, I will include all of the links in the show notes for everyone. And I wanted to say thank you so much for coming on today. I love the message that you're spreading in terms of getting people into these like good deeds, random acts of kindness, volunteer, all of those pieces. It's like, it's all equal. It's just, you got to get it where it makes sense for you.

Jenn Klein (33:37.566)

Thank you so much for having me. It was my pleasure to talk to you and I'm eager to, if any of your listeners wanna reach out to me, they can go to my website, youa and I'm happy to help them as well and we will link my resources in the show notes.

Dr. Ashley Blackington (33:53.939)

Awesome, I love that. Well, thank you again.

Jenn Klein (33:56.426)

Thank you.